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 Post subject: Re: Dont have to worry about the feds taking guns, states wi
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 6:40 pm 
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"The 2nd amendment is a doomsday provision." This is a video of a legal immigrant reciting more about our US history than most Americans could.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=39e_1360125919

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 Post subject: Re: Dont have to worry about the feds taking guns, states wi
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 11:38 am 
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That was good Ryan, BUT, if I may, I seriously doubt that in my lifetime or yours, we will be taking our guns up against our government!

Look what Bush and Cheney put this country through! Some, or most people may believe Bush and Cheney were responsible for all the deaths on 9/11, and yet we did not mount an armed coup!

There is no big push for trying them for treason.

Americans are too apathetic. We will never use guns to change a "tyrannical" government.

Besides, I submit, the computers and internet of today is what guns were to those who wrote the second amendment.

The biggest threat to a tyrannical government is all of us being interconnected and informed, not us being armed.

Besides if nearly half the country are right-wing wing-nuts, and the other half, bleeding heart liberals, an armed revolution would just be one, big, giant gun fight! The "real enemy" would just sit back and laugh!

The right-wing wing nuts would just protect "the powers that be" who are the enemy. Our enemy and theirs too, they would protect.

What would one big, giant, gun fight accomplish? Besides needlessly killing an awful lot of Americans?

Some people need to face the facts. The second amendment is out dated.


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 Post subject: Re: Dont have to worry about the feds taking guns, states wi
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 8:39 pm 
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Until the 2nd Amendment is changed through the means set forth in the Constitution we as a nation, our politicians as sworn to uphold the constitution, are required to uphold it.

Stony...you're off base so far my grandmother could pick you off on the right wing nuts would protect our enemy. No matter what the enemy, the left wing is the one to protect them. From court trials for terrorists to big government, liberals always protect the enemy.


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 Post subject: Re: Dont have to worry about the feds taking guns, states wi
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 8:45 pm 
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Stony wrote; "Some people need to face the facts. The second amendment is out dated."
Stony, you are a minority of one regarding this argument, it is very annoying.

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 Post subject: Re: Dont have to worry about the feds taking guns, states wi
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 10:27 pm 
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I'm not arguing against the second amendment, I'm just saying that it needs to be updated.

It's confusing as to who it assumes is in the "militia", and which "arms" we are allowed to have. And against who we are to use the arms. These issues need to be better defined. And it should be done by a constitutional amendment rather than a supreme court interpretation. In my humble opinion.

Flash, as far as your statement: "our politicians as sworn to uphold the constitution, are required to uphold it". Our Constitution and bill of rights also deals with treason. Conspiring to overthrow the elected government is treason. Stockpiling weapons and ammo with the intent to one day overthrow the elected government is probably treason! Punishable by death.

At what point do you think our elected government will admit it is a tyrannical government that the people should be allowed to overthrow by force?

Some of us (Americans) who incorrectly thought we reached that point already were badly mistaken, witness Ruby Ridge and Waco Texas!

If you and your buddies decide to overthrow the government, you need to be sure you are going to win! Or be hung and/or shot for treason!

I'm quite sure a bunch of hillbillies are not going to win a gun fight against the US government! Not with with their drones, nuclear war heads, biological and chemical weapons.

I'll say it again, the second amendment is outdated.


It was written at a time in this country when a bunch of armed citizens COULD take over! Those days are long gone!

Just ask any native American how successful a citizenry can be, who are out gunned! Those at Ruby Ridge and Waco learned the hard way.


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 Post subject: Re: Dont have to worry about the feds taking guns, states wi
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 12:05 am 
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Stony wrote; "Stockpiling weapons and ammo with the intent to one day overthrow the elected government is probably treason! Punishable by death" The intent is not to overthrow the government Stony, (as i think you well know) but rather to have the right to protect ourselves from the government overthrowing us. Also regardless of the odds, I would still rather face them armed, as not. I certainly do not need you making that decision for me. BTW, the second ammendment is just fine the way it is.

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 Post subject: Re: Dont have to worry about the feds taking guns, states wi
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 8:05 pm 
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Stony wrote:
Flash, as far as your statement: "our politicians as sworn to uphold the constitution, are required to uphold it". Our Constitution and bill of rights also deals with treason. Conspiring to overthrow the elected government is treason. Stockpiling weapons and ammo with the intent to one day overthrow the elected government is probably treason! Punishable by death.
Who is stockpiling except a few nuts? Who is planning on overthrowing the government except a few nuts? I hear those statements mostly from left wing liberals, NOT from right wing conservatives.

Stony wrote:
At what point do you think our elected government will admit it is a tyrannical government that the people should be allowed to overthrow by force?
Rhetorical question? We both know the government would never admit to being tyrannical.

Stony wrote:
Some of us (Americans) who incorrectly thought we reached that point already were badly mistaken, witness Ruby Ridge and Waco Texas!
Comparing law abiding citizens to criminals? Try again.

Stony wrote:
If you and your buddies decide to overthrow the government, you need to be sure you are going to win! Or be hung and/or shot for treason!
If it ever came to that treason won't be the word used, it would be enemy combatant. If I sided with anti-government side I would expect to have endangered my own life.

Stony wrote:
I'm quite sure a bunch of hillbillies are not going to win a gun fight against the US government! Not with with their drones, nuclear war heads, biological and chemical weapons.
I just knew your tracks went nowhere, like your bridge. You think the government, in trying to put down an American Spring would use those weapons on American soil? You're one siding shy of a completed manifest.

Stony wrote:
I'll say it again, the second amendment is outdated.

It was written at a time in this country when a bunch of armed citizens COULD take over! Those days are long gone!

Just ask any native American how successful a citizenry can be, who are out gunned! Those at Ruby Ridge and Waco learned the hard way.
Now you train of though has lost its caboose. You continue to believe that everyone that is for individual rights and against the government curtailment of those individual rights is planning on overthrowing the government. You are wrong. I should be able to keep my weaponry at my choice, without interference from the government, as long as I don't misuse that weaponry. Not because I have the right to but rather because I want to. What business is it of the government's if I have dozens of handguns, dozens of rifles, a dozen shotguns, and enough ammo for each to last me a lifetime? None of their business. This issue is about individual freedoms, not the overthrow of the government. This issue should be based on common sense, not the gun controls emotional appeal to the ignorant electorate.


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 Post subject: Re: Dont have to worry about the feds taking guns, states wi
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:15 pm 
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They say you can't argue with the facts, but I'm sure a bunch of you will try!


Attachment:
gunskillpeople.jpg
gunskillpeople.jpg [ 49.55 KiB | Viewed 242 times ]



I'm sure every single one of you reading this is the exception to the above rules ..... save your breath.

Why is it you suppose the NRA won't let the CDC keep records of shootings? Think about that!

IF guns did more good than bad, they should be glad to have the CDC document every single gun shooting in this country.


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 Post subject: Re: Dont have to worry about the feds taking guns, states wi
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:39 pm 
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Why is it you suppose the NRA won't let the CDC keep records of shootings? Think about that!

http://factcheck.org/2012/12/gun-rhetoric-vs-gun-facts/

Where'd these guys get all their CDC information, make it up?


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 Post subject: Re: Dont have to worry about the feds taking guns, states wi
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 10:28 pm 
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The answer is incredibly simple Stony, Dont keep guns in your house and dont worry about the rest of us. Besides that, since when does the CDC have anything to do with guns?

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Last edited by citizen on Fri Feb 08, 2013 10:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Dont have to worry about the feds taking guns, states wi
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 10:39 pm 
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Wow! I can't believe my eyes sometimes.

Stated above, Stony doesn't want his laws judged in the court. This would be the 3rd branch of government. Noooo. We want to write new laws that say what you think the original law says. Or make it say what you want it to say. All of this BEFORE deciding what it actually says. How interesting. Why do we need the Judicial branch then? In fact, why do we need Congressional branch? There seems to be quite a few that think that the King should just decide what is right. In fact, the King himself has told you that is the way it is supposed to be. "Quit playing politics and do it my way." Some of you will make very good subjects.

Why doesn't ANYONE want the CDC to keep information of shootings? The Center for Disease Control is supposed to concern itself with the containment, erradication and source of diseases to help prevent pandemics. There is no disease spread by freedom. There is no disease caused by firearms.

Data is collected on shootings. The FBI and BATFE cooperate to gather data on firearms crimes, shootings, accidents etc. They could actually do a better job recording some of the details so that we could perform better analysis. For instance, when they quote somewhere around 11,000 firearms deaths, they don't really tell you how many were justifiable, accidental, self inflicted etc. They could granulate the data further to give a better picture of what is really happening.

The catchy little lefty posters with "facts," I would like to see what data proves a single one of those statements.


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 Post subject: Re: Dont have to worry about the feds taking guns, states wi
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 10:51 pm 
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Great post.

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