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 Post subject: Re: A letter to the editor
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:15 pm 
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Interesting USA Today poll.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/quickquestion/2007/november/popup5895.htm


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 Post subject: Re: A letter to the editor
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 10:09 pm 
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Stony, I wish I was a Hippocrates! Then I'd be a wise physician instead of just a normal, decent, patriotic citizen who happens to be a member of the NRA.

I DO think we need new NRA leadership. We are not the enemy, and we need folks opposed to our cause to realize that. Mr. La Pierre isn't doing the rank and file any good and ought to get the boot. As a member, I will work from within to accomplish that instead of disassociating myself from the organization entirely.

And I think that most NRA members would say that there should be laws governing firearms, and there are: hundreds upon hundreds of them, on state, federal and local levels.


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 Post subject: Re: A letter to the editor
PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2013 9:14 am 
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Well said, Phantom. As a hunter I was an NRA member for many years. I gave up on them when they insisted we all should have the right to buy bullets that could pierce the vests worn by police officers at the time. I couldn't rationalize that.

The leadership kept moving more towards the extremists and the interests of the gun manufacturers, who give them millions. I'm very pro gun ownership but I'm pro gun sense too. Even Justice Scalia has said the 2nd Amendment does not give you the right to own military weapons.

If we are to believe the surveys, the majority of NRA members favor background checks and sensible regulation. I wish NRA would take a leadership role in the process instead of just saying no to everything.


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 Post subject: Re: A letter to the editor
PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2013 8:51 pm 
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Awful inconvenient of them to put "a well regulated militia, being necessary for a free state, the right of the people to keep and bare arms shall not be infringed".

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 Post subject: Re: A letter to the editor
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 9:32 am 
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"Americans have the right and advantage of being armed - unlike the citizens of other countries whose governments are afraid to trust the people with arms." (James Madison, The Federalist Papers #46 at 243-244)

"No Free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." (Thomas Jefferson, Proposal Virginia Constitution, 1 T. Jefferson Papers, 334,[C.J.Boyd, Ed., 1950])

"On every question of construction (of the Constitution) let us carry ourselves back to the time when the Constitution was adopted, recollect the spirit manifested in the debates, and instead of trying what meaning may be squeezed out of the text, or invented against it, conform to the probable one in which it was passed." (Thomas Jefferson, letter to William Johnson, June 12, 1823, The Complete Jefferson, p. 322)

"The Constitution shall never be construed....to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms" (Samuel Adams, Debates and Proceedings in the Convention of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, 86-87)

"The strongest reason for people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." -- (Thomas Jefferson)


Guess we don't need to interpret the meaning of the 2nd amendment. The founding fathers made it perfectly clear.


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 Post subject: Re: A letter to the editor
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 9:54 am 
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Quote:
"No Free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." (Thomas Jefferson, Proposal Virginia Constitution, 1 T. Jefferson Papers, 334,[C.J.Boyd, Ed., 1950])
"The strongest reason for people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." -- (Thomas Jefferson)


From a site debunking misused and untrue quotes:
Thomas Jefferson

The strongest reason for people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.

Occasionally this phony quote attributed to Thomas Jefferson is given with the following citation: Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 (C.J.Boyd, Ed., 1950). The publication exists, but the quote does not. And the editor's correct name is Julian P. Boyd, not C.J. Boyd. In other cases, this quote is added to the end of a proven Jefferson quote


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 Post subject: Re: A letter to the editor
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 9:59 am 
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What are those arms? A nuclear bomb? Armor peircing rounds? Antitank missles? Mines? Grenades? Grenade launchers? All of these are considered arms.


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 Post subject: Re: A letter to the editor
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 11:30 am 
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Well unionman, not having even been in a firefight, and not ever wanting to be in one, I would not be the best person to ask. Too bad we don't have a time machine, we could ask the victims of:
1.Ottoman Turkey
2.Soviet Union
3.Nazi Germany
& Occupied Europe
4.China, Nationalist
5.China, Red
6.Guatemala
7.Uganda
8.Cambodia
(Khmer Rouge)
9.Rwanda

and other governments what they feel would have been a good weapon set to resist oppression. Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership was founded out of the ashes of their disarmed ancestors, they have a pretty good grasp.

http://jpfo.org/

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 Post subject: Re: A letter to the editor
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 9:32 pm 
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The truth about assault weapons. http://www.assaultweapon.info/

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 Post subject: Re: A letter to the editor
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 10:02 pm 
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Very good, Ryan! It lays everything out.


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 Post subject: Re: A letter to the editor
PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 10:21 pm 
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Yes, Stony, please read it, you will change your tune.

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 Post subject: Re: A letter to the editor
PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 8:40 am 
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I am not sure exactly where I stand on this. As others have said, the issue is clear, the solution is not.

I will say that something needs to be done.

As for Ryan's slide show, the ranch rifle shown is a Ruger Mini-14. It was designed using the M14 as a model. The M14 was a standard issue military weapon from the 50s through the 70s. The M21 and M25 sniper rifles were designed using many of the working parts from the M14.

Here is that same ranch rifle with a few very minor changes:
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